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31-08-2014, 23:14
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חבר מתאריך: 13.11.04
הודעות: 16,823
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הויכוח שלך הוא לא איתי
כפי שתוכל לקרוא במאמר המצוין הזה, ה ATF עצמו טען שהכוח שביצע את הניסיון הראשון והכושל לא היה מצויד דיו ושאנשיו היו מצוידים בתמ"קים ואקדחים (למעט מספר רובי M16 שכנראה הושאלו מהצבא).
Can Soldiers Be Peace Officers? The Waco Disaster and The Militarization of American Law Enforcement
http://www.uakron.edu/dotAsset/46ae...2db74282b85.pdf
C. Helicopters, Machine Pistols, and other Weapons
1. Helicopters
While the National Guard helicopters were not armed, at least some of (p.632) the BATF agents on board the helicopters were carrying MP-5 machine pistols, contrary to assertions by some government officials.[64] Significant evidence suggests that the BATF agents in the helicopters strafed the roof of the building. For example, Dr. Bruce Perry examined the Branch Davidian children who left the compound in the weeks following the BATF raid. One child drew a picture of a house beneath a rainbow. Perry asked, "Is there anything else?" and the child then drew bullet holes in the roof.[65] Newsweek magazine reprinted the Davidian girl's picture of her home with a dotted roof. "Bullets" the girl explained.[66]
2. Armor-piercing Ammunition
If BATF forces on the ground were using the armor-piercing 9mm Cyclone ammunition (as some sources claim)[75], such action was in disregard for the safety of noncombatants. BATF knew, or should have known, that the armor-piercing ammunition it was using could easily penetrate the thin walls of the compound at Mount Carmel Center, endangering the children whom the BATF claimed to be protecting from abuse.[76]
BATF's perception was very different, that the agents were expressly armed mostly with 9-mm machine pistols. "We knew there was a lot of children in there. And we knew there were a lot of women and innocents in there.... And with all these innocents in there, our teams ... took mostly 9-mm firearms that they knew would not penetrate those walls, they knew would not go through and hit innocent children. And, so, in essence, the beating we took was because we were trying not to have firearms that would go through the walls."[77] Actually, (p.635) 9-mm rounds can penetrate thin walls like those at the Mount Carmel residence.
3. Machine Pistols
More fundamentally, BATF's claim that it went into the Mount Carmel Center underarmed is ludicrous. Ten agents were carrying AR-15 semiautomatic rifles.[78] This rifle, whose rounds can certainly penetrate walls, has been described by the BATF itself as an extremely powerful "assault weapon" primarily useful for mass murder.[79]
The majority of agents, though, were armed with Heckler & Koch MP-5 machine pistols.[80] These weapons are sold almost exclusively to the military and police. The advertising to civilian law enforcement conveys the message that by owning the weapon, the civilian officer will be the equivalent of a member of an élite military strike force, such as the Navy SEALs. The ad copy links civilian law enforcement to military combat, with lines like "From the Gulf War to the Drug War." As one criminologist notes, "The MP5 series is the pride and the staple of police tactical operations units, and it holds a central place in the paramilitary police subculture. Its imposing, futuristic style overshadows its utility as a superior 'urban warfare' weapon."[81]
IV. The Waco Siege and the Hostage Rescue Team
HRT commander Dick Rogers later testified that the sole purpose for the Bradley Fighting Vehicles (BFVs) was agent safety; some BATF agents had been wounded by grenades, and the Branch Davidians had a pair of .50 caliber rifles.[98] When Koresh told negotiators that he could destroy the nine Bradley Fighting Vehicles (BFVs) that were originally brought on-site, the BFVs were supplemented with two M-1A1 Abrams tanks and five M278 Combat Engineering Vehicles.[99] Once in place, however, the tanks were used for purposes that did not seem defensive. At various times, tanks would charge at the building. One person (p.640)inside the building reported that men in the vehicles were "shooting the finger at these kids,"[100] and in at least one case "mooned" the Davidians.[101]
לגבי "שפעל תחת חיפוי צלפים ותצפיתנים.", נהפוך הוא, כפי שתוכל לראות שוב ושוב בדוח הרשמי של האירוע, בניסיון הראשון לא נעשה שימוש מושכל לא בתצפיתנים ולא בצלפים כתוצאה מחוסר נסיון והכרה של מפקדי הפעולה בחשיבות האלמנטים הללו
4. A lack of knowledge existed on the part of both command and operational personnel concerning the proper utilization and deployment of countersniper (Forward Observer Team) personnel.
The element of surprise was totally lost prior to raid commitment and was known to command. To compound the strategic aspect of loss by surprise, the raid plan was not followed with regard to: 1.) diversion element (helicopters were not on station) 2.) forward observation posts/counter snipers (posts were not in position to report or cover) 3 . ) airborne observation and communication (communications ineffective and not on station, and
The weapons of choice and authorization did not consider contingency planning for ambush, explosives and superior firepower. The intelligence available to the planners and most certainly known to the managers required a contingency plan. The use and deployment of observation posts was minimized to the extent of being ineffective. Counter sniper considerations were not adequately presented in the plan and were never fully deployed even as planned. That oversight was fatal.
אגב בניגוד גמור ל ATF, ה FBI דווקא עשה שימוש נרחב בתצפיות ובצלפים במהלך המצור והפריצה השנייה, כפי שניתן לקרוא בדו"ח הרשמי והנפרד שלהם.
לגבי התמונות שהבאת, אני גרסתי שהן מניסיון הפריצה השני המאוחר, אחרי קבלת הסיוע הצבאי, ולא מהראשון. תודה על ההבהרה.
בעקבות אירועי ווייקו החלה בחינה מערכתית-משפטית מעמיקה של הנסיבות הפתלתלות שהביאו למעורבות הנרחבת של הצבא בפעולה ולאחר מכן הוחלט שה ATF וה FBI יצמצמו את תלותן בצבא ובמשמר הלאומי וירכשו לעצמן יכולות עצמאיות משמעותיות יותר לביצוע משימותיהן. בעקבות החלטה זאת גדל תקציבן של הסוכנויות בצורה משמעותית. בין 1993 ו 2001 (קרי לפני אירועי 11/9!) גדל תקציב ה FBI ב 60%, מצבת אנשיו גדלה ב 30% ובין היתר אושרה הצטיידות תקדימית ב 8 מסוקי בלקהוק כדי לבטל את התלות בהשאלת ציוד צבאי. בין 1998-2008 הוכפל תקציבו של ה ATF ומצבת אנשיו גדלה ב 30%. בעקבות לחץ כבד של שרת המשפטים החדשה בממשל קלינטון (ג'נט רינו, שנכנסה לתפקידה במהלך האירועים), צמצמו משמעותית הרשויות הפדרליות את השת"פ שלהן עם הצבא, למעט מודיעין החיוני למלחמה בסמים ובטרור, זאת עד לחילופי השלטון ולאחר מכן אירועי 9/11. |
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